The full n-Latin square is the n × n array with symbols 1, 2, . . . , n in each cell. In this paper we show, as part of a more general result, that any defining set for the full n-Latin square has size n 3 (1 − o(1)). The full design N (v, k) is the unique simple design with parameters (v, k, v−2 k−2 ); that is, the design consisting of all subsets of size k from a set of size v. We show that any defining set for the full design N (v, k) has size v k (1 − o(1)) (as v − k becomes large). These results improve existing results and are asymptotically optimal. In particular, the latter result solves an open problem given in (Donovan, Lefevre, et al, 2009), in which it is conjectured that the proportion of blocks in the complement of a full design will asymptotically approach zero.