Project courses are a cornerstone in the information systems and software engineering education offered at the NTH (Norges Tel~ni~ke HCgskole = Norwegian Institute of Technology). In thi~ paper we present our two main project courses, one taught in the 2nd year and one in the 4th year.We focus most on the 4th year project course, which is the most special, in that there are real, external clients. The course is compared to other project courses which have been reported on. A major distinction between our 4th year course and other courses is that our students are provided with problems which are only very loosely defined at the outset of the project. Advantages and disadvantages of this approach are discussed. This course has been very well received both by students and clients.