Critical responses by Marwala and Ntlatlapa challenged Moll's refutation of a contemporary technological revolution as a necessary but not sufficient stratum of a Fourth Industrial Revolution (S Afr J Sci. 2023;119(1/2)). This rejoinder suggests that they work with loose criteria about what counts as a 'revolution', and therefore confuse the character of industrial, scientific and technological revolutions. Therefore, their defence of the existence of a new, contemporary technological revolution, and a related economic, social and geopolitical revolution, rests on shaky conceptual ground. Neither the pandemic nor an unprecedented fusion of technologies has produced a 'Fourth Industrial Revolution'.The Commentaries by Marwala 1 and Ntlatlapa 2 on my article 3 are welcome. One unfortunate consequence of 4IRassociated managerialism in universities is the stifling of critical academic debate. As the gigification of universities takes place, knowledge claims or research results are increasingly considered to be measurable performance units on digitised university rating scales. Robust debate of this kind is amongst the casualties.Ntlatlapa is concerned that the title lacks precision: "[it] leaves the reader with the feeling that … a technological revolution is a fallacy". Of course, he is correct. When I formulated the title, I took it to be implicit that the 'technological revolution' it refers to is a nascent 21st-century technological revolution, a necessary but not sufficient component part of a 4IR. So the title of the article should be "Why there is no new, contemporary technological revolution, let alone a 'Fourth Industrial Revolution'". However, my argument remains that there is no 4IR, including a claim that there is no new, contemporary technological revolution.Both Marwala and Ntlatlapa charge that to "dismiss [the 4IR] as by-product of these technological changes would be myopic" 1(p.2) . I agree entirely. Indeed, I make it quite clear in the article that one cannot reduce an industrial revolution to a technological revolution: "An industrial revolution … is the fundamental transformation of every aspect of industrial society, including its geopolitical, cultural, macro-social, micro-social, economic and technological strata" 3(p.1) . Most of my other writings on the 4IR are systematic demonstrations that there is no 4IR in broader social, cultural and geopolitical terms. [4][5][6] Growing global and national wealth divides, precarity of work for ordinary people, hollowing out of the middle classes, fragmentation of identity and culture, and marginalisation of the South by offshoring, outsourcing and 'onshoring back to the Cloud', are all sustained, deepening aspects of the 3IR. I repeat what I suggested in the article: "it appears increasingly clear that the 'brave new world' of the 4IR is not really happening" 3(p.1) .